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MatPlus.Net  Forum General The aesthetics of rundlaufs |
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| | | (1) Posted by Michael McDowell [Friday, Oct 10, 2008 17:28] | The aesthetics of rundlaufs
The timing of the announcement of the Prcic-70 JT falls in nicely with this post. Perhaps Mike could give his opinion, which might help potential competitors!
Model mates have an aesthetic hierarchy. Mid-board models are considered superior to sideboard models, models using all the white force are considered superior to those where a king and/or pawns stand as spectators, and unusual models are considered superior to "standard" models.
Is there a similar aesthetic hierarchy for rundlaufs? I have always regarded rundlaufs forming regular shapes as superior to those where a piece follows an irregular path back to its starting square. Best of all are those where the regular shape traced involves moves of the same length. A square looks better than a rectangle.
Take the following problem. It was inspired by a one-line h#4 by Miroslav Stošić (1st Prize, Schach-Echo 1971 – see the FIDE Album) which combined black knight and white rook rundlaufs, the rook tracing a rectangle. My idea was quite specific - a one-liner combining one small square and one larger square with parallel moves. Having failed to find a sound setting over a number of years (I didn't have access to computer testing in those days) I showed the scheme to Michel at the BCPS weekend in 1991 and he produced the published setting.
Michael McDowell and Michel Caillaud
3rd Prize, The Problemist 1992
 (= 6+13 )
Helpmate in 4
1.Kg2 Bxe4+ 2.Kh3 Bg6 3.Kxg4 Be8+ 4.Kf3 Bc6 (there are incidental set plays)
Now compare the following problem.
Anders Lundström and Christer Jonsson
feenschach 1982
 (= 7+5 )
Helpmate in 4 (Set)
1…d6 2.Kd5 Rg8 3.Ke6 Be8 4.Kf6 Rg6
1.Kd3 Bxf5+ 2.Kc4 Bd7 3.Kxd5 Be8+ 4.Ke4 Bg6
Is this simply a complete anticipation? It doesn't illustrate the precise idea that I set out to show. Is there a worthwhile aesthetic gain in having both paths trace out squares? The Swedish joint is much neater of course, but that reflects the difference in the composers' aspirations.
I'd be interested to hear opinions on any of the above points.
| | | (2) Posted by Harry Fougiaxis [Friday, Oct 10, 2008 21:10] |
To me, it is almost completely anticipated, even if indeed the bishop square Rundlauf gives a better impression than the rectangle. I was curious to check WinChloe, and you can't imagine my surprise when I saw that even the Swedish joint is (completely, this time) anticipated by Roméo Bédoni, The Tales in Russia 1969 (v) !! The only difference is that the pawns b4/b5 are better placed on a4/a5 in Bédoni's problem. According to WinChloe again, Bédoni's problem is included in his 1997 book "Problèmes d'Echecs en tous genres" and is quoted in text in Schach-Echo 4/1984, p.157. Pity that it is not included in Mike Prcic's book "Rundlauf in Helpmates" (I have the first edition of 2003).
Btw, in the remarks field of your problem it is stated : anticipé par R. Bédoni (avec un rectangle de Fou au lieu du carré, mais une position beaucoup plus économique et un jeu apparent exact!) The comment might well be by Michel himself, but I can't be sure.
| | | (3) Posted by Guy Sobrecases [Friday, Oct 10, 2008 21:43] |
Looking at the construction of these nice problems, I can better appreciate the difficult task of showing a WB-square circuit with this matrix. This 8x8 board is really too small.
Much easier of course without a model mate:
 (= 7+6 )
h#4
1.Kd2 B×f4+ 2.Kc3 Bd6 3.K×d4 Bf8+ 4.Ke3 Bh6‡
| | | (4) Posted by Ian Shanahan [Monday, Oct 13, 2008 01:36]; edited by Ian Shanahan [08-10-13] |
I'm not knowledgeable enough about rundlaufen in helpmates to opine much, but in the field of series-movers, capture-free rundlaufen are highly regarded. Indeed, there was at least one theme tourney run for them in the 1970s. In general, I would think that a rundlauf's motivation would surely be the most crucial factor (even more than its shape?) - regardless of the genre.
| | | (5) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Monday, Oct 13, 2008 12:58] |
My opinion on Rundläufe (German plural - but how on
earth do you build a plural in a foreign languange -
Rundlaufs?) is that a "chaotic" rundlauf needs much
more inventiveness than, say, a square one like the
one depicted above, and so I would prefer the
chaotic one.
Hauke
| | | (6) Posted by Ian Shanahan [Wednesday, Oct 15, 2008 03:20] |
@Hauke: Please forgive my misspelling: in English, we normally say 'rundlaufs' for the plural; I know that 'Rundlaufe' is the correct German and can't explain my error. Sorry. As for your point about "chaotic" Rundlaufe, I agree and reiterate - surely the MOTIVATION is the most important factor.
| | | (7) Posted by Michael McDowell [Wednesday, Oct 15, 2008 10:03] |
Thanks for the very interesting contributions. Having read Harry's views I was in broad agreement and thought that my joint with Michel could at best stand as Bédoni (version). But then Guy posted his problem and I have to say that of the three settings I like this best! I don't think it occurred to me at the time not to aim for a model mate. My attitude to models in helpmates has changed over the years. I now regard them as essentially incidental additions. They are worthwhile if they can be worked in naturally, but no helpmate should ever be strained to include a model (and doesn't the strain show in the 1992 joint!)
I agree with Ian and Hauke that motivation comes first, though that wasn't the point of my post. I think Hauke is being too sweeping in saying that a "chaotic" rundlauf needs more inventiveness. I have seen regular rundlaufs that showed very interesting motivations (sometimes needing close examination to be appreciated) and many irregular ones with trivial motivations. The problem I have with irregular rundlaufs is that often the fact that the piece returns to its starting square just seems irrelevant, if you notice it at all. I suppose that essentially I see the rundlauf as an idea whose appeal is visual, and regular features are more appealing to the eye. Still, it would be a boring world if everyone thought the same!
| | | (8) Posted by Neal Turner [Wednesday, Oct 15, 2008 14:40] |
One aesthetic feature which hasn't been mentioned is the significance of the starting square.
I would say it would enhance the effect if there was some reason why the moving piece was sitting on the particular starting square other than just that it was end square of the rundlauf.
But I suppose this is too much to ask in most settings.
| | | (9) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Wednesday, Oct 15, 2008 14:51] |
@ Neal: good point. Maybe unpin the Rundläufer in the 1st move?
@ Ian: see note.
Hauke
| | | (10) Posted by Axel Gilbert [Thursday, Oct 16, 2008 00:37] |
I don't want to play the "everybody is right" guy, but I think that we can consider two kind of Rundlaufe :
- "Strategic" ones. They key word here is 'motivation'. The most subtle motivation, the more crooked the path, the better.
- "Visual" ones. Here, we praise the beauty of the geometry. Regular shapes, or shapes that echo are wanted. Then, I should come with light, pleasant setups, and model mates are welcome (for I feel if the same type of beauty than geometric shapes).
The example shown above is clearly a "visual" rundlauf (there is strategy, of course, but Indian theme is anything but new !). So having two Rundlaufs of the same shape is an improvement in itself (that is not worth the heaviest position, btw).
PS : as an editor (Phenix helpmates), my position about anticipations is often to ask the author's point of view. I generally trust composers' good faith, so if I find a partial anticipation, I like to show it to the composer and ask him if he considers his problem to be "different enough". In this particuliar case, maybe both composers don't share the same opinion !
| | | (11) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Thursday, Oct 16, 2008 16:12] |
BTW, if anyone still has a copy of "Krumme Hunde"
(mine begins to desintegrate due to perusal) look
up the "Zwiebelturm" - don't even remember offhand
if it's a rundlauf but it surely is a crooked path
as trivially motivated as can be.
And then in feenschach there was an article about
the condition "Return in n serial moves [Circe]",
so to say a stipulation with in-built rundlauf character.
Here is an appetizer by myself: Kh6/Kf4 Bd3 Sh5, RC#15.
(I.e. white moves and returns to h6 in 15 serial moves, Circe.
Obviously he can't do it immediately, and this was just
a quick proof that White doesn't have to stand in check
in the original position for this effect.)
Hauke
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