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MatPlus.Net Forum Competitions Schwalbe Theme Tourney 213
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(1) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Tuesday, Sep 10, 2013 10:03]

Schwalbe Theme Tourney 213

Or so I think it's 213.

Construct a legal, orthodox (and white king not in check) position
where all white moves are mating and are

a) given by the same piece
b) given by the same kind of piece

with the options that you use
1) no promoted material
2) promoted material.

Official example for K-a-1: Kb2 Ba1 Pe2 Pd3 Pc4 - Kd4 Pc5 Pe3

Send your record attempts (first number of variants, then number
of pieces etc., you know the standard) to Silvio Baier.
Ending only 2014 (forgot the exact date, will edit that in).

(Read Only)pid=10919
(2) Posted by Thomas Brand [Wednesday, Sep 11, 2013 07:20]

Yes, 213. Schwalbe Theme Tourney is correct; see announcement in 262 Die Schwalbe (August 2013), p.180f.

Closing date is February 28, 2014; send entries to Silvio Baier (Mail: hilfsmatts(at)
(Read Only)pid=10920
(3) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Thursday, Sep 12, 2013 11:42]

Small clarification (I asked Silvio): Promoted material that is only
needed to prove the legality but doesn't appear in the position
will be filed under "1, no promoted material".

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(4) Posted by Geir Sune Tallaksen Østmoe [Sunday, Sep 15, 2013 19:27]

If a pawn can promote and thereby give a discovered mate, is it considered four different moves, or just one?
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(5) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Monday, Sep 16, 2013 17:15]

Good question, I forgot to mention that. Yes, all promotions count
to the variant maximum.

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(6) Posted by Adrian Storisteanu [Saturday, Nov 2, 2013 16:36]

1.- Any particular reason there is no section for illegal positions? (It's such unusual fun to fill the board.) Have these already been tackled in the past?

2.- Hauke's "you know the standard": I must plead ignorance... Shouldn't one just send in the diagrams, and let the (poor) judge sort 'em out?
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(7) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Monday, Nov 4, 2013 15:28]

1. I think Silvio won't behead you if you send in an illegal position
"for comparisional purposes". (Although I doubt that this would beat
the legal record except maybe for Q). I have no idea why it was made so,
ask Silvio.
2. Yup, just bombard Silvio with your positions (best all 10 minutes
with an improvement :-). After all, he just needs to keep record of
the record and file the rest under "close but no cigar".

(Read Only)pid=11099
(8) Posted by Adrian Storisteanu [Monday, Nov 4, 2013 15:35]

"Although I doubt that this would beat the legal record except maybe for Q" - from my attempts so far, the illegal S beats the heck out of it!... :-)
(Read Only)pid=11100
(9) Posted by seetharaman kalyan [Monday, Nov 4, 2013 19:06]

I presume that these 'mate' records would have been attempted and economy established long ago. Is there any place I can check the existing records ?
(Read Only)pid=11101
(10) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Tuesday, Nov 5, 2013 11:29]

@Adrian: OK, I didn't do the math :-) (I just did a quick
experiment - S isn't as trivial as I thought.)
@Seetharaman: Again - ask Silvio. He *did* the research.
(Although - half of the fun is you DON'T know where the
record is.)

(Read Only)pid=11106
(11) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Thursday, Jun 19, 2014 12:54]

The results are out. If you are interested in a particular subtask,
just ask me and I post it here. (Unfortunately, it's NOT on the
SCHWALBE website.) Tomorrow I will have the new issue with me
and at least post the table with number of mates and men.
In the meantime, just this:

Karol Mlynka and Hauke Reddmann, DD task, 40 forced mates
(= 14+8 )

Slight variation (Qa8<->Bg8, R elsewhere) is possible.
(Read Only)pid=12374
(12) Posted by Adrian Storisteanu [Thursday, Jun 19, 2014 13:43]; edited by Adrian Storisteanu [14-06-19]

Darn, FORTY forced QQ mates! :-) Though I'm sure I had just as much fun coming up with my measly 34...

Hats off!

[NB Well, at least I got the (trivial) R mates right - ]
(Read Only)pid=12375
(13) Posted by Geir Sune Tallaksen Østmoe [Thursday, Jun 19, 2014 14:47]

Wow! I was down on 31 in that task, with six queens. I also found a position with eight queens, but that one had even fewer mates.

Looking forward to see the table and compare the numbers to mine.
(Read Only)pid=12376
(14) Posted by Frank Richter [Thursday, Jun 19, 2014 17:23]

By the way - Michael Schreckenbach won the whole tourney.

I found 38 queen mates with only 6 queens:
(= 14+7 )

Too much blocking pawns were needed :(
(Read Only)pid=12377
(15) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Friday, Jun 20, 2014 14:34]

Yup, I had such a position too. When I set up Karols scheme
(he was first as Silvio said), I estimated the number of mates
to be around 30 and was baffled when the computer actually
counted them.
Nice tourney. I was simply too smug as usual :-) - getting
only 6 positions optimal. But I'm still proud getting the 40
in the king, eh queen discipline :-)

OK, here is the table. - means w/o promoted material, + with.
First number signifies mates, second men. % impossible, ?
no entry (probably not existing anyway, since the - position
is already optimal).

K- 6 8
Q- 8 16
R- 14 7
B- 13 12
S- 8 11
P- 8 8
K+ ?
Q+ 8 15
R+ ?
B+ ?
S+ 8 10
P+ ?
KK- %
QQ- %
RR- 26 13
BB- 14 17
SS- 16 20
PP- 16 20
KK+ %
QQ+ 40 22
RR+ 36 16
BB+ 24 22
SS+ 24 20
PP+ 21 23

(Read Only)pid=12379
(16) Posted by Adrian Storisteanu [Friday, Jun 20, 2014 16:44]; edited by Adrian Storisteanu [14-06-20]

Thanks a lot for the table.

I didn't even submit positions for Q+ and S+. Thought somehow that promoted force implies looking for QQ+ and SS+...

My largest misses seem to be B- (just 7 mates, instead of 13) and QQ+ (the round-number 40 achievement is very nice; the eventual next record, 42, will answer a few important questions too).

Anyway, looks like I got a few right nevertheless. Fun tourney, enjoyed a lot working on these positions.
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(17) Posted by Frank Richter [Friday, Jun 20, 2014 17:49]

The B position with full play of a battery is quite tricky:

(= 6+6 )

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(18) Posted by Adrian Storisteanu [Friday, Jun 20, 2014 17:52]

Nice position indeed, the B- with 13 forced mates. That chain of pins is very clever.
(Read Only)pid=12382
(19) Posted by Geir Sune Tallaksen Østmoe [Friday, Jun 20, 2014 21:22]

Very fun tournament, I enjoyed it a lot! Looks like I did poorly on QQ+ (9 mates short) and BB+ (6 mates short), but I did something right too. :)

The one I enjoyed the most was SS+, but apparently I had one piece more than I needed there.
(Read Only)pid=12383
(20) Posted by Hauke Reddmann [Saturday, Jun 21, 2014 19:48]; edited by Hauke Reddmann [14-06-21]

B- : Tricky but crackable with pure logic. :-)
BB+ is cool, as in the whole contest I underestimated
the power of randomly B peppering :-)
(Read Only)pid=12387

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MatPlus.Net Forum Competitions Schwalbe Theme Tourney 213