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MatPlus.Net  Forum General Restriction of publication of problems with WCCT themes |
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| | | (1) Posted by Juraj Lörinc [Tuesday, Apr 17, 2007 00:04] | Restriction of publication of problems with WCCT themes
I have received some very good problems for the magazine showing WCCT theme, but I am not allowed to publish them if I do not want to break following wish of WCCT organizers (or PCCC).
Quote from page http://www.saunalahti.fi/~stniekat/pccc/8intro.htm :
"Editors of chess magazines are asked not to publish problems with themes of this tournament before the award of the WCCT is printed."
Personally, I do not understand this restriction. As long as problems competing in WCCT are known (even if not published in the sense of Codex or Rules or wherever there is formulated "publication" for WCCT problems), there should not be any doubt regarding priority and originality of WCCT problems.
So why these problems cannot be published now?
| | | (2) Posted by Iļja Ketris [Tuesday, Apr 17, 2007 10:16] |
I too have such problem in stock and may try to explain the restriction so:
If this problem is published now, the striking similarity between it and a WCCT entry will be apparent to the judges, would allow them guess the attribution of the entry, and, therefore, may affect their judgment.
| | | (3) Posted by Uri Avner [Tuesday, Apr 17, 2007 13:45]; edited by Uri Avner [07-04-17] |
As spokesman of the WCCT subcommittee, I would like to respond to Juraj's question:
The restriction is necessary for several reasons:
a) To avoid any kind of influence on the judges. It is not difficult to imagine all sorts of possible influence (e.g., a published problem is better than a certain entry for the WCCT).
b) The WCCT entries are not officially published yet, i.e. the entries booklet is not considered an official publication in the usual sense. Problems not chosen for the WCCT award are free to compete as originals in other tourneys. Therefore, the question of priority is a real one for the case in hand.
c) An idea of a given WCCT entry may be exploited by another composer for another problem (even if not in a way it might be considered anticipated). This seems unfair in the situation where the WCCT award is not yet published. The least we can do is wait with the publication of the new problem until the WCCT is over.
So, dear editors, please hold your horses for a little while longer. Thanks!
| | | (4) Posted by David Knezevic [Tuesday, Apr 17, 2007 14:30] |
Another point: problems selected for WCCT are in fact published (on PCCC site). Editors, if they wish, could check the originals they receive against the WCCT entries and decide what to do. As far as Mat Plus is in question, I, as well as ditors of other columns, already have too much obligations and too little time to be able to do it. So, until the WCCT results are published such originals will be rejected.
| | | (5) Posted by David Knezevic [Wednesday, Apr 18, 2007 14:03] |
I jast had to reject, with regret, one original moremover - but I don't feel good at all after this. Does it mean that in next few years no moremover with switchbacks, let alone "rundlaufs", should be published? Sounds silly for me!
It seems that in order to be "saved" some themes should be prohibited for WCCT :)
| | | (6) Posted by Juraj Lörinc [Wednesday, Apr 18, 2007 23:37] |
Thanks to Uri for quite comprehensive answer. My remarks to mentioned reasons follow.
> a) To avoid any kind of influence on the judges. It is not difficult to imagine
> all sorts of possible influence (e.g., a published problem is better than a certain
> entry for the WCCT).
In an ideal world any judge would strictly differentiate between problems published before and problems published after public appearance of WCCT entries. Newer problems should not be considered as anticipations and the judge should be able to imagine that WCCT problem were composed without knowledge of the later problem, while the other way it need not be true. We are not living in the ideal world and this influence might be partially harmful. But in any case it is not different from any other theme tourney, either anonymous, where judge(s) know only positions or informal, where judge(s) know everything about competing problems - in any case the new better thematical problems might be published between start and end of judging process. WCCT is in no way different, just more important.
On the oter hand, if newer published problem is technically better rendering of WCCT problem idea/scheme, this should not be considered as harmful. It would just show to judges that the idea is not shown ideally in WCCT problem - and that is something the judges should test anyway, I mean they should try to improve construction of competing problems as a part of the judging process.
> b) The WCCT entries are not officially published yet, i.e. the entries booklet is not
> considered an official publication in the usual sense. Problems not chosen for the WCCT
> award are free to compete as originals in other tourneys. Therefore, the question of
> priority is a real one for the case in hand.
This point I see as a serious weakness of WCCT. I understand that competing problems are not published as given by rules/codex/or I do not know hwere it is written. But think about it for a while: problems are shown to the public, but not considered published. Sounds strange, doesn't it? In my opinion, all competing problems should be considered published in WCCT with date of publication of booklet, just awarded will get placed (as in any yearly tourney) and names of authors are published later.
> c) An idea of a given WCCT entry may be exploited by another composer for another
> problem (even if not in a way it might be considered anticipated). This seems unfair
> in the situation where the WCCT award is not yet published. The least we can do is
> wait with the publication of the new problem until the WCCT is over.
This is just another consequence of centaurish form of WCCT publication - not a man, not a horse... some hybrid that satisfies just few. If the approach suggested above is used, i.e. all WCCT problems are considered published in the competition booklet, this trouble would disappear as well.
> So, dear editors, please hold your horses for a little while longer. Thanks!
Nevertheless, I repeat I understand current rules and thus I had to reject publication, with much regret. I am just proposing this way out of troubles for the very next WCCT.
| | | (7) Posted by Uri Avner [Thursday, Apr 19, 2007 01:50]; edited by Uri Avner [07-04-19] |
There is a special situation regarding the WCCT entries. The WCCT is a formal tourney, but unlike any other formal tourney the entries are known to the public long before they are judged. Because the WCCT enjoys a special status, it has to be protected as far as possible from undesirable consequences which might stem out of the unique method by which it is conducted. Hence the regulation we have about publishing problems which show the WCCT themes. True, every regulation carries by its very nature a certain price. We hope that the price is not too high (nor too long) in this case. We are trying to accelerate the whole process, so that (among other things) this price will be as light as possible.
Thanks to all editors for their patience and cooperation!
| | | (8) Posted by David Knezevic [Friday, Apr 20, 2007 11:59] |
Chris Feather, who prefers one-to-one discussion, wrote to me that he agrees with Juraj Lörinc about publishing WCCT problems.
I must say that I am not sure what is right. Perhaps it should be left to editors to decide for each individual problem they receive whether they may or may not influence the WCCT results. I did not compose anythibg for current WCCT and therefore I usualy cannot recognize the (WCCT) theme at once, so I must rely on information supplied by authors. I cannot guarantee that I will be able to obey the PCCC recommendation.
However, it seems that this WCCT will be "expressly" conducted, according to the time table found in (already!) printed booklet with originals. In that case, there is a very small chance that originals received now, and published probably in Autumn or Winter, months would influence the jugements.
| | | (9) Posted by Uri Avner [Friday, Apr 20, 2007 15:39]; edited by Uri Avner [07-04-20] |
It is a well known fact that rules and regulations are not extremely popular among people who consider themselves artists...
The WCCT organizers cannot do much but ask for the good will of the editors.
All sort of unfairness and absurd situations can arise from publication of problems showing WCCT themes during the tourney period. Some of them I've stated previously on this Forum; on top of these, just imagine the flood of problems not selected to represent the respective countries in the WCCT, or the possibility of these problems to be selected for an earlier Album compared to those that are taking part in the WCCT. I think no great harm is caused by suspending the publication of these problems by a limited period.
So, again, dear editors, please do not ignore the wider picture, and give us the benefit of the doubt, that some of our recommendations are not completely arbitrary...
| | | (10) Posted by Hans Gruber [Saturday, Jun 16, 2007 13:10] |
Hi all,
just a note to say that the Director of the current WCCT tries hard that it will NOT be "several years" until the award is published ... less than one year from now, I hope.
Hans Gruber
| | | (11) Posted by seetharaman kalyan [Tuesday, Jan 25, 2011 14:14] |
Just going through the latest WCCT 9 themes ! The threemove theme appears to be very broadbased.
Are there any threemove problems with three or more variations which do not qualify? I would be interested in seeing such a problem.
| | | (12) Posted by Juraj Lörinc [Tuesday, Jan 25, 2011 14:52] |
Hm... interesting to see so old topic dug up... so long ago and the situation is here again.
Fortunately (?) I am not originals editor anymore/now, so I need not care about the unforceable wish of WCCT organizers in this position. Naturally, as an author I will strive to obey the wish.
Nevertheless I am sure there will some composers sending WCCT-themed problems to editors and even there will be editors publishing such problems, as it was not so rarely the case in the past. Would you mind if such sins are reprinted here for the sake of public assessment of
a) moral integrity of authors and editors,
b) WFCC authority to convince authors to respect its wish?
| | | (13) Posted by seetharaman kalyan [Tuesday, Jan 25, 2011 20:30] |
Actually this question should have been a new thread. But I happened to see this old thread and seemed relevant. While I understand and accept the reasons for the restriction for not publishing originals of the WCCT themes, my question pertains to this specific threemove theme.
| | | (14) Posted by Juraj Lörinc [Tuesday, Jan 25, 2011 21:19] |
Actually, I do partially underline your point.
In #3 the theme might be fulfilled even unintentionally, as it is in many examples.
The sin there is no sin - author just happened to show WCCT theme and the editor might have considered it not prominent in the problem or even might have missed it.
The theme of #2 is also quite easy to show and might be done by the way.
On the other hand, #n or fairy themes are very specific and editors can hardly claim they have missed it.
Public opinion might decide. Authors and editors should be aware of that and should avoid publication to prevent their own problems from being scrutinized in the negative light.
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